Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Hello, peace be upon you. I’m Khalid Al‑Harbi — a CIPD member, HR Director, and HR Consultant for several entities. Today’s episode marks the first in a new series we’re launching with the CIPD, and in Arabic. God willing, through this series we’ll host many leaders in human resources, along with influential figures in this field. Our aim is to explore key topics related to the role of HR in Saudi Arabia, its connection to national transformations, and the importance of the CIPD. Today, we’re hosting an influential colleague in this space: Mr. Malek Qaisi. Welcome, Malek. Before we begin our discussion, I’d like you to introduce yourself — and I’m sure the audience would also like to get to know you a bit more.
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Thank you. I’m grateful for this opportunity and happy to be with you. I’m Malek Qaisi. I currently work in organisational development, rewards management, performance management, and talent management. I began my HR journey in 2014 by studying a Bachelor’s degree in Human Resources Management. After that, I worked across several sectors, including global companies. Over the past seven years, my focus has shifted more toward organisational development and rewards. I progressed through multiple CIPD certifications — starting with the Level 5 Diploma, then Level 7 in Organisational Development and Design. Last year, I earned the Chartered Membership through the CIPD’s Experience Assessment. That’s a brief introduction about me.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Great. I notice that although your experience spans 11 years, it’s both rich and very focused. Let’s go back to Malek in 2014. From your perspective, what’s the difference between HR back then and HR today?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Excellent question. When I first started, the focus was mainly on HR operations: recruitment, payroll, regulatory compliance, Saudisation, and similar activities. Today, the landscape is completely different. HR has become a true strategic partner. My focus now is on how to support the business in achieving its strategic goals. HR is no longer just an operational function; it’s part of the strategy itself, adding value through data analysis, presenting insights effectively, anticipating future needs, and launching initiatives that directly support the business.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): You mentioned a very important point that’s widely discussed among practitioners: HR operations. What exactly do we mean by HR operations?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): They differ from one organisation to another, but in general, I refer to the daytoday HR activities. For example: issuing letters, preparing contracts, managing employee files, overseeing attendance and leave, handling employee issues, processing resignations, and ensuring compliance with Saudisation requirements and HR regulations. That’s the simplified picture of what I mean when we talk about HR operations.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Excellent. Saudi Arabia has gone through many shifts over the past 10 to 13 years — fundamental, tangible, and noticeable changes. Some of these shifts happened in just three or four years.
Malek Qaisi (Guest): That’s true.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Naturally, all of this had an impact on business and HR is part of that. From your perspective, what are the transformations that reshaped the reputation and role of HR over the past 12 to 13 years?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Great question. I’d say the first major shift began around 2016–2017 with Saudi Vision 2030, which placed people at the centre of economic transformation and that was a beautiful shift. Then came the COVID‑19 pandemic, which changed many concepts in the work environment. Practices changed drastically — there was a clear “before and after.” And most recently, the digital transformation in Saudi Arabia — the rapid move toward innovation and digitisation. This shift changed many practices and made several things easier, especially within HR. These are the most prominent changes I recall throughout my career.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): We often hear that HR’s role is not operational, but strategic. The terms “operational” and “strategic” come up frequently, and there’s a strong call for HR to shift from an operational role to a strategic one. Based on your experience and your discussions with practitioners and peers in the field — what internal factors need to be in place within organisations to enable HR to make that shift?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Great question — very clear. I believe the most important factor is ensuring that every initiative is linked to the organization’s strategy. As a strategic partner, I need an HR strategy that is derived from the company’s overall strategy. It’s essential that the initiatives I lead are directly connected to that strategy — that’s where the real impact lies. Previously, HR was more reactive.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Not proactive.
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Exactly — not proactive.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): It was simply responding to events rather than launching initiatives.
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Exactly. There was no added value. Success was often measured by the number of transactions or requests handled, not by strategic impact. So, it’s not just about counting requests; it’s about impact, the return on each initiative, and the value added. It’s very important that we, as HR professionals, become true partners — contributing real value to the organisation we work for. Instead of focusing on the volume of requests or remaining reactive, we need to be proactive, guided by a clear strategy. Our decisions and initiatives should be data‑driven. I should be able to say: “I’ve done the work, and these numbers genuinely support this initiative…”
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): It has a real impact. It’s not just about numbers for the sake of hitting a dashboard target.
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Exactly. That’s the difference when you talk about being a strategic partner in the organisation.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Despite all the initiatives, support programmes, and significant backing from government entities to shift HR’s role from reactive to proactive and strategic, the reality is that many organisations still treat HR as a reactive function — simply providing services rather than acting as a strategic partner. Why do you think that is? Where’s the challenge? Why are these organisations still unable to keep up with the change?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Great question. From my perspective, the HR leader within the organisation is the key person who can change this perception. We still see many operational practices happening. I can’t go to CEOs in the market and say, “Hey, HR is strategic — you need to treat it that way,” while the HR function in my own organisation isn’t actually strategic in its practice. So, the responsibility falls on the HR leader — they are the ones who can change this concept within their organisation.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Okay, let’s assume the HR leader in the organisation has tried to make that shift, but there’s no support from senior management — from the CEO, for example. What can I do then? I’m proactive, I’m an HR manager or leader, and I want to drive change — but I’m not getting support from top management. Why is that? Why is the HR leader, specifically at this stage, the one being held accountable?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Great question. Let’s go back to the basics: Do I have a clear strategy? Do I have goals with measurable impact, supported by data? For example, if you go to the CEO and say, “We want to change,” you need to demonstrate things like higher employee engagement, issues within the salary structure. Have I analysed exit interviews? Have I reviewed employee engagement surveys? Do they consistently point to the same issues? Have I benchmarked against the market and confirmed there’s a real problem? What’s the impact if I make a change? What’s the financial effect? Can I calculate the cost of losing an employee? What’s the return if I invest in a training or development programme? I believe that if I approach it this way, things will change.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): To simplify: you need to speak the financial language leaders understand.
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Exactly
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Excellent. Based on your experience, where do HR leaders usually face resistance — from other departments? Let’s assume there’s support from senior management and we’re starting the transformation. Where does resistance typically come from?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): I won’t name a specific department, of course. (laughing)
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Apart from the fact that we have our close relationship with the finance department — of course, they’re our dear colleagues.
Malek Qaisi (Guest): If I’m truly presenting value and impact, if what I’m requesting from senior management as a budget has real impact, then perspectives will change. I’ve had experiences where we secured buyin and approvals from senior management and the relevant departments — because there was real impact. It wasn’t based on assumptions; it was based on data. The data showed we needed to do 1, 2, 3 — and that the investment would deliver 1, 2, 3 in return. Resistance is natural. But usually, if senior management is supportive…
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): ..everything becomes easier.
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Everything becomes easier. Resistance might then come from employees — but that’s manageable. I don’t think there’s a contradiction between having senior management support and still facing resistance from a specific department — unless there’s a lack of clarity, the impact isn’t evident, or I’ve tried to implement a project without involving the change management team.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): This next question is important for many practitioners listening to us: I’m currently an HR practitioner, and 95% of my work is operational. What skills or competencies do I need to start shifting from operational to strategic HR?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Great question. I think the most important skill is commercial awareness or business acumen — understanding the nature of the business, the numbers, and the return on investment. Another key skill is data analysis — linking decisions to outcomes. Also, presentation and persuasion skills are crucial — being able to present analysis results clearly and tell the full story. These are probably the top three skills that help me shift to a strategic role.
Additionally, I believe it’s important to be open‑minded — open to changes in the sector I work in, and to the demands of other departments. Sometimes those demands may seem illogical or unsupported by policy, but I might need to adjust my own policies. That’s very important.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): I agree with you, but I’d like you to go deeper for a minute or two into the idea that HR practitioners must understand the business. We hear this a lot, but many people think it’s not necessary. How important is it really for HR professionals to understand the business? Can you give examples? When we say that HR practitioners must understand the business — how important is this?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Sure. Let’s take the financial sector as an example. The role of fund managers isn’t just managing portfolios. If a client sees high turnover in fund managers — for instance, the fund manager changed multiple times in three years — they won’t invest. That’s a red flag. So I need to understand how this affects the business.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): This affects the business.
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Yes, it absolutely does. Another example: what do clients expect from our employees? If a client meets a wealth manager or relationship manager — is that employee presenting the product well? Do they have the skills needed to convince the client to invest or stay? That’s also part of HR’s role. What are the sector trends? For example, the financial sector is tied to Vision 2030 and the Financial Sector Development Programme. I need to keep up with that.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Let’s move to a very important topic — career development and the employee’s professional journey, especially with the CIPD as a career partner. You’ve been involved with CIPD for over five years?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): More.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): More — and how have the CIPD qualifications and initiatives positively impacted you?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): My journey with the CIPD started right after I graduated and got my first job. My manager introduced me to the CIPD Profession Map and asked me to identify where I was and where I wanted to be. Based on that, I started working on myself. He suggested I take an assessment that gives you results and a development plan. It gave me clear competencies that aligned with the market — very useful. It helped me understand how to move from, say, Associate Level to Chartered Level.
One of the most valuable things CIPD taught me is evidence‑based practice.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Everything is built on data.
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Everything is built on evidence. You analyse, benchmark against the market, and present results based on evidence. That changed a lot of my thinking.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Excellent. What do you think the CIPD can offer to HR in Saudi Arabia, especially with all the transformation and growth happening?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): I’d say the CIPD Profession Map gave the market and HR professionals a clear framework — it defines the competencies needed to practise HR, even if you specialise in something like rewards. Under that, there are things you can learn — like financial literacy, understanding financial impact, and so on.
The CIPD offers training and development for members, plus a wealth of resources and articles that I benefit from. It gives you a clear methodology.
I’ve seen initiatives where CIPD partnered with government entities, where practitioners were enrolled in CIPD Level 3 and Level 5 programmes linked to Vision 2030 and related projects.
One idea I support is having a licence for HR practitioners possibly mandatory and renewable. This is something I genuinely believe in.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): A licence to practise for HR practitioners. Just like other professions — healthcare, engineering, accounting — all have licences. I believe HR needs this too.
If you could go back 12 or 13 years and meet Malik just graduating from university — imagine someone who is in your place back in 2014. What advice would you give someone entering the HR field today?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): The advice I followed myself was this: before graduating, I always looked at what the market required. The advice I followed personally was to review job postings before graduating and see what the requirements were. Then work on those requirements. There were many things needed, but to summarise them simply as skills or core principles for HR professionals:
The first is integrity — for me, this is number one. It’s very important to be honest in your work, and this honesty directly affects your role as a strategic partner.The second is understanding the business — the sector you work in must be well understood. The third is to start learning. For example, through CIPD. Obtain professional certifications that give you a solid foundation and expose you to best practices. Build on that foundation and learn how to practise your role as a strategic partner within organisations.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Excellent. Let me wrap up with a few simple questions. Malek, I’d like you to summarise each one with a single word. You started your career around 2014, right?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Right.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Give me one word to describe HR at the beginning of your career in 2014.
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Operational.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): And in 2025?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Data‑driven.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): What are your expectations for HR in 2035?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): I believe it will be highly proactive and always ahead of business needs.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): What is one thing HR practitioners should stop doing immediately, based on your experience?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): That’s an important question. Reactive decisions — I think this is the most common issue.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): And what is one thing HR professionals should start doing now?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Building culture, measuring impact, and continuous learning — these are very important.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Final words, Malek?
Malek Qaisi (Guest): First, I’m happy to be here. I always say that change starts with us — not with the CEO or other departments. I truly believe this and have experienced it in practice: when I changed, the people around me changed — whether it was the finance department or senior management. They all changed because something real was happening. It wasn’t just talk or empty promises.
Khalid Al‑Harbi (Host): Malek Qaisi, may God bless you. We truly appreciate your presence and the insights you’ve shared with us. We’re honoured to have you — and you are, by the grace of God, the first guest in the KSA thread of the CIPD Middle East People podcast. We’re delighted to have you with us, and as always, you’ve enriched the conversation. Thank you for joining us. May God bless you. Wishing you all the best.
Malek Qaisi (Guest): Thank you, and may God bless you and protect you.
